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Post by mikkel on Feb 7, 2024 9:02:18 GMT -5
It is usually sufficient to cut the style and apply the pollen. Sometimes the pollen doesn't stick, in which case olive oil helps. I have only done it without olive oil.
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Post by ilya11 on Feb 7, 2024 10:58:53 GMT -5
Self incompatibility in citrus depends mostly on elimination of self pollen by specific ribonucleases. It can be broken by pollination of immature flowers, temperatures, overloading with foreign pollen, etc.
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Post by ilya11 on Feb 7, 2024 11:10:37 GMT -5
Gulripshsky is interesting hybrid Satsuma x pomelo Zucketta? and it is available in EU, Does anyone have experience with this variety? Quality of fruit, rippening time, hardiness etc
I have it in a pot, it is maturing in early December, fruits have good sweet/ acidity ratio, moderately juicy, some degree of bitterness, 13° Brix.
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jibro
Full Member
Czech Rep. | USDA 6b
Posts: 163
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Post by jibro on Feb 7, 2024 13:04:04 GMT -5
So Gulriphsky is decent, but nothing special...Ilya do you have opinion about Pervenec, it supposed to be hybrid from Shivamikan x Orange with a good hardiness but I also read that is just nucellar seedling from this cross, thank you. Have you observed anything to indicate that it is indeed a hybrid?
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Post by ilya11 on Feb 7, 2024 14:16:43 GMT -5
So Gulriphsky is decent, but nothing special...Ilya do you have opinion about Pervenec, it supposed to be hybrid from Shivamikan x Orange with a good hardiness but I also read that is just nucellar seedling from this cross, thank you. Have you observed anything to indicate that it is indeed a hybrid? Pervenets is ripe at the middle of December, fruits are smaller than average for oranges, fertility is high, plants in the open ground are compact. Very seedy, taste of the avarage orange. I do not think it is a hybrid.
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jibro
Full Member
Czech Rep. | USDA 6b
Posts: 163
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Post by jibro on Feb 7, 2024 14:37:55 GMT -5
Thank you Ilya for very helpfull information about these varieties and nice photos. I have bought many varieties in the past that looked interesting on paper, but they didn't work too well for me, so I prefer to look for real experience now...
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till
Full Member
Posts: 160
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Post by till on Mar 18, 2024 11:38:06 GMT -5
Does anybody know whether Sucrena is homozygous or heterozygous for low acidity? If have managed to cross it with Poncirus and I am curious now how probable it is that my hybrid is useful.
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jibro
Full Member
Czech Rep. | USDA 6b
Posts: 163
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Post by jibro on Apr 11, 2024 10:32:43 GMT -5
I do not know about Sucrena, but I have my first hybrid seedlings from Poncirus trifoliata "Hodonín" x Sikeri cross, 3 seedlings have larger middle leaf a smaller two other leaves, one seedling does not have the two small first tiny leaves as all other Poncirus seedlings have... It looks like Hodonin can produce hybrids as a seed parent, out of 8 seedlings there may be 4 hybrids, and Sikeri has viable pollen. Hodonin and Sladka trifoliate are also flowering right now, month earlier than usual, and I only have Chandler flowering, so I pollinated all trifoliate flowers with Chandler.
Edit: acidless orange Sikeri was pollen parent not Sucrena, I had a fruit on Sikeri pollinated with Tachov trifoliate but it was seedless, looks like using trifoliate as seed parent might be an easier way to get hybrids...
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Post by ilya11 on Apr 11, 2024 11:27:42 GMT -5
Indeed, last year I pollinated Hodonin flower with Valentine pollen. Out of 8 seedlings two are definitely hybrid.
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Post by mikkel on Apr 11, 2024 16:16:05 GMT -5
Does anybody know whether Sucrena is homozygous or heterozygous for low acidity? If have managed to cross it with Poncirus and I am curious now how probable it is that my hybrid is useful. I think that at least one backcross generation (from several F1 hybrids) is needed to make progress. Or at least a cross between different F1 Poncirus x Citrus hybrids (or vice versa) with low acidity to combine the many desired traits in one plant. If Sucrena is heterozygous, 75% should be useless for this low acid trait. If it is homozygous, 50% is useless for breeding. I would not suspect that any of the F1 plants would express the trait.
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till
Full Member
Posts: 160
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Post by till on Apr 12, 2024 1:13:48 GMT -5
Hi Mikkel, I can not really follow your logic. My hope with the cross Poncirus x Sucrena is that I get a sweet citrange or at least a citrange that is sweet enough to show that it has the low acid trait. At the moment, I do not head for a perfect citrange. Its only a first step. Regarding percentages, I would come to different numbers than you: - Given that the acidless trait in Sucrena is recessive 0% of the offspring will be sweet no matter if it is heterozygous or not. - Given that the acidless trait in Sucrena is dominant or intermediary 100% of the offspring will be (relatively) sweet when it is homozygous and 50% if it is heterozygous. If you don't look for the phaenotype and only focus on the genotype than 50% of the offspring will have the acidless trait in case of heterozygosity and 100% in the case of homozygosity. That would be the great advantage of using use Siamese sweet as the crossing partner. We know that it is homozygous for low acidity. That means every single hybrid will contain the desired trait. And it would be recognizable since the trait is intermediarily inherited. --------------- I will soon post some more pictures. My impression is that I have more than one hybrids of Poncirus x Chandler. My Sucrena had no pollen when temperatures were cool but plenty of fertile pollen when temperatures were high. Here a picture of Citrumelo (type??) x Sucrena: As you see a very high percentage of hybrids, I would say 100%. The citrumelo normally has a much lower percentage of zygotic seedlings. The same Citrumelo crossed with Morton. Also many hybrids, probably also 100%: The citrumelo, i. e. the motherplant, looks very much like Swingle 5 Star but is not the same.
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Post by mikkel on Apr 12, 2024 2:40:56 GMT -5
- Given that the acidless trait in Sucrena is recessive 0% of the offspring will be sweet no matter if it is heterozygous or not. you are right I made a mistake.
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till
Full Member
Posts: 160
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Post by till on Apr 12, 2024 5:26:11 GMT -5
In fact, I wrote too fast. Sorry. My calculation was also partly wrong at a closer look and I partly corrected you for the worse.
Given that the acidless trait in Sucrena is recessive 0% of the offspring will be acidless sweet and Sucrena is homozygous.
Given that the acidless trait in Sucrena is dominant 25% of the offspring will be acidless sweet if Sucrena is heterozygous and 50% if it is homozygous.
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